Selfheal

Ideas to improve our server or the forum.

Selfheal

Postby Salmiakki » 21 Oct 2012, 12:28

I know that this is a controversial topic, but what do you guys think about rambo-medicing? Most of the guys on the server are OK but occasionally we do get a share of 'You can't put bullets fast enough in him as fast he can heal' :)
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Re: Selfheal

Postby gaoesa » 21 Oct 2012, 12:53

I know sometimes medics don't know how to play the game. But the alternative would be even worse. Disabling selfhealing would destroy teamplay from those who actually try to play as a team.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby divine_one » 21 Oct 2012, 17:16

At the juhu server there was a 7 second penalty for selfhealing. We can discuss if that was a good idea or not, but players were complaining a lot and i think that was one of the reasons why the server has died.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby Synapse » 31 Oct 2012, 14:13

I remember in one server they disabled selfhealing but they made the Health bar growing more more faster. That can be an idea as well.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby jussi » 01 Nov 2012, 16:33

Disabling selfheal would be stupid. It is part of the game. No need to blame others for failing to kill target faster than he can heal. ~20 hp per second can easily be outdamaged if you actually get headshots once in a while.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby puolakanaho » 01 Nov 2012, 20:21

as jussi said and to add to that its not worth punishing the rest of the players if one medic doesnt know how to play the game
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Re: Selfheal

Postby Synapse » 02 Nov 2012, 16:39

To be honest I don't see it as a punishment. And I don't understand why you insist that much on to keep selfhealing. Being medic is not meant to selfheal most of the time.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby gaoesa » 02 Nov 2012, 17:24

Certainly it is a punishment as any delay before being able to consume med packets will keep the low health medic out of the reviving actions. Even 2 seconds is a very long time in this game. There are times the medics have to operate without full health taking 1-2 packs sometimes and dispecing packs to others as well. And it can be critical to get those packs. Not to mention that medics are often the targets of choice when stopping larger groups in attack.

Lets say you are a medic and in order to revive that important player you will take damage 100 worth before being able to hide behind the revived player from further hits. At that point you are only 1 headshot away from death and you should now wait for another medic to come and heal you or wait for the 2 or more seconds until you can consume your first own packs. Clearly, in this situation the wise medic will not go for the revive unless he/she has a self sacrificing mentality.

I.e., preventing medics from doing their designated work is a punishment for them. Also, against the very idea of the selfheal limitations as far as I understand them.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby Synapse » 02 Nov 2012, 18:07

Medics should sacrifice for sure. They cannot complete any map by themselves. They need engineers which is so defenseless while constructing anything or planting dynamites.
gaoesa wrote:Not to mention that medics are often the targets of choice when stopping larger groups in attack.

That shouldn't mean medics should be the strongest class.

And an another idea can be that medic packs heals "medics" 5 more hp or 10. It is very annoying when medic shoots next to a corner and when he is about to die he selfheals heals heals, but when you follow he can kill you with a full health. So maybe if he can only heal himself so less, other player can have a more chance to have a more fair firefight.

Btw, while talking about even 2 seconds are important.. Then if a medic cares about the objective and seconds are so important, he would go to revive engineer or whatever class is needed, without thinking to stay alive.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby gaoesa » 02 Nov 2012, 19:46

Medics should sacrifice for sure. They cannot complete any map by themselves. They need engineers which is so defenseless while constructing anything or planting dynamites.


You missed the point. The engineers are even more vulnerable when medics won't stay by their side. If medics have no way of surviving as a part of the team, they surely will not move with it. Before the objective is completed, there needs to be a lot more revives then only one.

And an another idea can be that medic packs heals "medics" 5 more hp or 10. It is very annoying when medic shoots next to a corner and when he is about to die he selfheals heals heals, but when you follow he can kill you with a full health. So maybe if he can only heal himself so less, other player can have a more chance to have a more fair firefight.


That has nothing to do with covering other players and this is actually to what the limitations will lead. Medics will stay behind their corners with their precious well aged med packs. When establishing camp sites, the egoistic engineers will come and steal the aged packs even though you would be offering new packs for them. The only good outcome is that the medic will die in an instant and so does the engineer uness he can really defend alone against a large group. I have seen these kind of behaviours when playing on a server with these kind of limitations.

Then if a medic cares about the objective and seconds are so important, he would go to revive engineer or whatever class is needed, without thinking to stay alive.


This is a personal opinion, but I do think that if medics have no way of surviving in teamplay, they will probably direct their interests in other activities.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby Synapse » 03 Nov 2012, 00:30

gaoesa wrote:You missed the point. The engineers are even more vulnerable when medics won't stay by their side. If medics have no way of surviving as a part of the team, they surely will not move with it. Before the objective is completed, there needs to be a lot more revives then only one.

I was just making an example for last seconds through objective that only engineers could. And of course medics are not there for only reviving and healing but also backing up people to complete objective. Many times happened that when I was with low HP and I revived an engineer even I died, in few seconds new spawned people came. So of course medics should stay alive. But making them strong like this leads them to play alone or with other medics to only kill. Not to play objective. Well there is nothing to do if they play with other medics, it's just a style of gaming. But maybe it could prevent playing alone and attract them to play the objective.
Also it's lame to throw medic packs and lay onto them, just shooting.. While getting hits, at the same time being healed by medic kits..

Oh well, as a last thing; what I have seen, engineers do the work alone most of the time. Medics heal or revive if anyone is around. Not backing up or following the objective maker. Backing up doesn't seem the first purpose for them.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby gaoesa » 03 Nov 2012, 01:36

You shouldn't make too big generalizations.

PS. We haven't made them strong.
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Re: Selfheal

Postby puolakanaho » 04 Nov 2012, 19:05

Synapse wrote:
gaoesa wrote:You missed the point. The engineers are even more vulnerable when medics won't stay by their side. If medics have no way of surviving as a part of the team, they surely will not move with it. Before the objective is completed, there needs to be a lot more revives then only one.

I was just making an example for last seconds through objective that only engineers could. And of course medics are not there for only reviving and healing but also backing up people to complete objective. Many times happened that when I was with low HP and I revived an engineer even I died, in few seconds new spawned people came. So of course medics should stay alive. But making them strong like this leads them to play alone or with other medics to only kill. Not to play objective. Well there is nothing to do if they play with other medics, it's just a style of gaming. But maybe it could prevent playing alone and attract them to play the objective.
Also it's lame to throw medic packs and lay onto them, just shooting.. While getting hits, at the same time being healed by medic kits..

Oh well, as a last thing; what I have seen, engineers do the work alone most of the time. Medics heal or revive if anyone is around. Not backing up or following the objective maker. Backing up doesn't seem the first purpose for them.



the thing is.the more the medic heals people the more experience he gets and the more bonuses he gets from them.so i think medics only go rambo if they really suck at this game or if they are REALLY GOOD AND REALLY BIG A HOLES
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Re: Selfheal

Postby Salmiakki » 04 Dec 2012, 20:17

Before someone misunderstands - there are always good players and bad players, and this applies to I'd say all classes. Most of the guys here play medics reasonably and I have no problem with that, with the occasional exception of the annoying rambo-medic camper with medpack stashes around the corner. The mechanics of the game is such that if selfheal is there, it's always better to selfheal and hope to kill the other guy (and then tend to teammates) than to sacrifice (even though many actually do that - but that's personal playstyle, not what the game rewards). One notable exception is if the dead mate is a medic than you can do circular revivings. Now, the same applies to engis, you CAN play an engi bad - if you hog the K43/M1 just for the grenades and don't intend to do plant, defuse, mine... Ditto for newbs hogging panzas, etc. I don't think there is a single good answer to whether selfheal is good or bad - it really depends on the server (as in - the people playing there), that's why I asked.
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